Been a long time since I posted, too long actually.
In world of warcraft there's such a thing as the trade chat channel. Many of you may ignore it due to annoying trolls and worrisome adolescents. I'd like you to get back into using trade for several different aspects of the ah game.
Create Buzz
One of the easiest ways to sell an item quickly is to create buzz on the trade channel. Have some adventurer's journals, a darkmoon faire deck or perhaps some mysterious fortune cards? Try talking up on chat and then as you get whispers about the items be sure to explain the benefits of each. Add into your trade barking that you will explain the value of the item to anyone who is curious. This will get you plenty of potential buyers whispering you for the juicy details.
If an argument starts about your item, try not to enter the fray. Simply continue with your bark and hope that someone sticks up for you. Regardless of the outcome of the argument, know that any publicity is good publicity and since there is a limit on how often you can bark, the more they talk about your item the better.
Sell Underhandedly
You'll need to wash your hands after this trick, but it works so I'll explain it to you. First, you get on an alt and post an item for X gold. Then, you get on trade chat and offer to buy the same item for 2X gold. Say that you need to go to a raid or something and need someone to bring the item to the location you will be raiding. If anyone whispers you just say yes I want the item. When they go to sell it to you, explain that you have to go for the raid and leave. Later on, when they ask you if you still want it, just state that you found it on the ah for cheaper. Mean right? Underhanded right? Well I see it happen constantly so at least now you can avoid it yourself.
Real Life Advertising
If you haven't noticed already, there are some BlogAds at the top of the site which I have provided for all experience levels of advertisers here at JMTC. Whether you are a brand new blog or a gold guide promoter, this is a great opportunity to get some eyeballs to your pages for cheap. As of right now the ads are going for $2 per day, a real deal when you consider the sheer number of visitors this site gets on a daily basis. Just like with trade chat, sometimes all you have to do is try a different avenue and you can find where your customers are lurking.
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33 comments: on "Underused Advertising Opportunity"
Anonymous said... March 24, 2011 at 10:25 AM
Perhaps I read that wrong, but are you advocating scamming people? I'm pretty sure "tip" #2 is against the Terms of Service and would avoid it like the plague...
Also, I'm not sure what tip #3 has to do with making gold. Is the post about advertising in game, or out of it? You could be looking at 2 completely different audiences here, so it might get a bit confusing.
Vayaz said... March 24, 2011 at 10:29 AM
The "create a buzz" can definitely backfire, but it depends on the item you're trying to sell.
Mysterious Fortune Cards are commonly known, so that's probably a good candidate for advertising, but when I was posting that there's Tracker Snacks on the AH during Pilgrim's Bounty, it didn't take long until some idiot showed up and ruined the price.
Harold said... March 24, 2011 at 10:34 AM
Ads on your site? I never noticed. (sarcasm)
Liam said... March 24, 2011 at 11:03 AM
I agree that creating buzz is a good way to market products.
I dont agree with scamming people, lying to them just to profit is pretty low.
Anonymous said... March 24, 2011 at 11:09 AM
Selling Underhandedly? Are you kidding? I never thought I would see JMTC advocate scamming, very dissapointed in you Marko. Maybe you should have framed your article as how to simply avoid the scam, but it seems you are advising people to try to make gold this way.
Part of the reason WoW is dieing is because of the community is being dominated by a bunch of rude jerks, hence the reason Trade chat is a form of unusual punishment. This attitude is embodied in your selling "strategy."
Shame.
Anonymous said... March 24, 2011 at 12:45 PM
I don't understand what the "Selling Underhandedly" section accomplishes. Are we just advertising our item for double the price in hopes that someone looks on the AH and attempts to flip the item we have already listed?
Does this actually work very often?
Markco said... March 24, 2011 at 1:05 PM
Lots of love for this post huh? The tip #2 is something that happens constantly.
If you want to believe I'm trying to get people to scam others feel free to, but the end result is that now more people know about it and will be less likely to fall for the trick.
It is not against TOS btw, and ranks right up there with selling items for the price of a stack in order to trick people into buying it.
Now, if you value relationships within your server more than the quick buck, obviously any of these wouldn't be a good idea :)
Uriul said... March 24, 2011 at 2:10 PM
"It is not against TOS btw, and ranks right up there with selling items for the price of a stack in order to trick people into buying it."
Blizzard (or at least some GMs) used to consider doing that a scam, you know, until they added another confirmation box for buyouts...
Whether it's against the rules or not, though, it's clearly a dick move. Personally, I'm not willing to trick people in order to make gold.
I actually never turn on trade chat in the first place, because reading it is painful. I don't care how much gold I'm passing up, it's just not worth it...
Bangkok Bill said... March 24, 2011 at 2:26 PM
I think that creating buzz can work but it really depends on the item. I use it for high value items and Fortune Cards but otherwise I don't have time. Creating buzz for over 1,000 auctions a day would be a bit much.
Tip #2 I would avoid. Even if no one finds out you will feel like crap after you do it. This is a game and should make you happy - not turn you into a self loathing small time scammer. Great information on what to look out for though.
Troutrouter said... March 24, 2011 at 3:59 PM
I have never used nor would I ever use Tip #2. It's not because I would feel bad or that it's a crappy thing to do. Hell, if the dolt is dense enough to be duped like that, he deserves what he gets. The reason why I wouldn't use it is that I loathe the trade chat and anything related to it.
Joniboy said... March 24, 2011 at 4:12 PM
So you think that you're do the players of wow a service be posting this.... Trying to turn this round into your favour by your reply, it wasnt ment in the way you are making out now, at least have some back bone and stick to what you posted and dont try to squirm out of it.
Anonymous said... March 24, 2011 at 5:38 PM
Selling underhandedly, really? There's already enough crap in the game. Don't spread more.
Whitewolf said... March 24, 2011 at 6:09 PM
Ok.
I'll pin Markco's arms.
You guys can punch him.
It's obvious that he's renewed his Brewfest Brew of the Month Club membership, foresaking his 12 Step program.
For Godsakes. Who forgot to hide his laptop?
Markco said... March 24, 2011 at 6:46 PM
WTB Really Dumb Commenters who take troll bait - Paying 500 gold
(posts several really dumb commenters for 300 gold each)
A buyer has been found...
A buyer has been found...
A buyer has been found...
Log out
Will said... March 24, 2011 at 7:42 PM
Once there was a guy in the forums that had had his account banned for tricking people into buying useless items for hundreds of gold using the Cash on Delivery (C.O.D) system. He couldn't understand why that was considered a bad SCAM, because, if people were being tricked it was their own fault for being so naive.
People explained to him that many players in WoW were likely under 15 years old, and could be easily tricked into buying such items, and that could lead to severe frustrations for the kid.
People also used an analogy, that taking candy from a baby, although easy as pie, was a bad.
So, the scam you're proposing here in #2, although a classic one, may be effective on 12 year olds.
However, I don't think JMTC editors, neither their readers, need to go to so low standards to inflate their already gold pool.
Just my two cents!
Joel Barnett said... March 24, 2011 at 8:49 PM
Ok, I think that it's funny that everyone is so upset about #2 on here. When I constantly hear gold bloggers and the general public of gold makers saying they pay people to farm for them. They pay less than AH and tell their farmers they will always pay X price no more no less. Well what happens when the prices go up and your still buying it for that same X price.. You are scamming them but you don't think about it that way..
I think Markco is just throwing it out there that it is a way you could make gold hes not saying go out and do it right now, or ever, its just a tip just like any other gold tip out there.
He even says: "Mean right? Underhanded right? Well I see it happen constantly so at least now you can avoid it yourself."
It is a game after all and we all have our own play styles. I am not endorsing scamming and do not do this myself but all in all it comes down to it being your choice.
That is all. :)
Cloud7007 said... March 24, 2011 at 11:34 PM
I like how everyone suddenly sprouts a conscience when a scam is pointed out. Markco knew what the immediate impulse of everyone was going to be when he posted it...
Thus: "You'll need to wash your hands after this trick" and "Mean right? Underhanded right? Well I see it happen constantly so at least now you can avoid it yourself."
The guy's not "advocating" anything. He's doing what he always does: relaying information.
So I find it funny when someone who doesn't have the balls to submit a form of verification (Anonymous #1), sits there and goes "shame shame, that's such a jerk move". Ever think about it the other way around? Like...
Someone innocent and unknowing who's in trade says "WTB blah at 400g". Well you know that the price of blah is 200g on the AH. Do you, being the kindhearted people that you are, go "Hey, it's on the AH for half that price though.", or do you go "Sure one sec, I'll sell you it at that price."?
We all know that everyone's gonna completely take advantage of that person while making profit for themselves. And yet, this method of gold making isn't frowned upon and the reverse is.
I don't really care either way. Both make you gold, both have consequences. I personally am not for building bad blood with my server, but to each their own.
Anonymous said... March 25, 2011 at 2:27 AM
@Loot Crazed
I don't see how you'd call that scamming.
If you have an agreement with someone for them to farm and you to pay a certain price then it's their choice to pay for the consistent buyer and avoiding AH fees.
Some people even go as far to write contracts and mail them to the farmers. Although it holds no true value, you surely cannot call that scamming.
Skorpsy said... March 25, 2011 at 8:49 AM
Wow! You certainly titled the post well at any rate.
I read this blog post with much disbelief. I am so EXTREMELY disappointed in you Markco! lol though, it does make me think of a really old sirlin debate (i know probly wrong gaming community for most to know who he is)
I suck at writing and I'm sure no amount of verbose comment I make is EVER going to properly convey the copious amounts of outrage, distaste, and extreme disappointment I now have for you.
I would never consider myself a very moral or overly ethical individual, but this, in my opinion completely crosses the line. It's bad on numerous levels for too many reasons to post. I guess everyone has their own spot where they draw the line. For me this is certainly it!
With how utterly flowing gold is this xpac it's completely not necessary for anyone to need resort to such low, underhanded tactics. This is seriously the Madoff scam of Wow.
You're not just simply taking advantage of dumb customers/people, you are purposely deceiving and attempting to trick customers in a fraudulent manner for your own personal gain.
At the least it is horrible karma, and an absolutely terrible business tactic. At the worst, while it might or might not be specifically covered in the ToS, it IS a bannable offense. On my server I noticed this strat heavily being done by a couple individuals last yr. At least two of them I know were definitely banned.
I've always had much respect for you Marko and considered you to be quite intelligent and very like-able personality wise. However, you've lost a ton of respect and alienated me a bit in the process with the posting of this absolutely underhadned tactic.
BAAAAD Markco! So disheartening. :(
Skorpsy@Ursin
Anonymous said... March 25, 2011 at 9:26 AM
This is the first time I've been compelled to write a comment on this blog. I think it is shocking and disgusting that you would post this tip. You are tricking people into buying your product. I'm all for putting things not worth much on the AH (like milk at winter time) but going out and convincing people to buy said items is not on. And for all those that read that 'tip' and knew it was something to look out for and avoid there are more that will read it and try to scam someone.
And yes, you can comment after that those of us who came to expect some integrity from this blog as 'taking troll bait', but it doesn't change the fact that what you posted was morally wrong and a horrible thing to do. (I also fail to see how a name like cloud7007 is less anonymous than anonymous#3 btw)
Markco said... March 25, 2011 at 10:26 AM
This reminds me of when I tried making a joke about casters being the best low level gold makers because they (used to) start with spring water in their bags.
No one got the joke and instead they debated about it on end for like 30 comments.
Now I post a classic scam that has been around for years and crap hits the fan.
If you don't get why it's posted, fine. Hate my guts. You're welcome!
Archangel said... March 25, 2011 at 10:38 AM
You guys fail to see it, don't you ? This post is aimed in generating traffic and comments. Marcko successfully failed lately to provide any kind of solid gold advice. And this is sad to see, having in mind the wow passionate Marcko in the beginning of his gold making adventures. This blog has been reduced to a merely real world money making machine and nothing more. Making real world cash is not a bad thing by itself, if the content is good and useful, which is failing miserably lately to be so. This kind of post is meant to stir you all up, thus generating comments and traffic. Because the cash must flow.
Garbage post and garbage attitude. Thumb down, Marcko !
XanderEragon said... March 25, 2011 at 11:17 AM
WOW people are going crazy over nothing WOW. Markco don't worry what people are saying about the post you were just infoming them about what people do to make Gold. Not like anywhere in your post you said run out and do it now.
Biggest problem with these people is when your or Mage make a post they close out there browser and log into the game and start doing what you say in that days post.
Because they have no sense of doing stuff there own way. They wait for the daily post before they do anything.
And Marko I like the Tactic for Getting Comments. :D
XanderEragon
P.S. If your gonna flame a post grow a pair of balls and Put your name on it.
Whitewolf said... March 25, 2011 at 1:05 PM
A lot of those 12-15 year olds read this blog and ARE probably better protected as a result of the scam being talked about here.
Maybe it would be worthwhile to devote an entire column to scam-prevention.
(Whitewolf works a double sided booth, selling ripe tomatoes on one side and clean towels from the other.)
The Lost Meeple said... March 25, 2011 at 1:08 PM
So Archangel, I've failed to provide any "good advice"?
Interesting.
The Lost Meeple said... March 25, 2011 at 1:24 PM
Scams happen all the time in the Wow Economy, there is sniping, which is generally frowned upon but it technically is a scam. I've heard stories where someone lost a Spectral Tiger due to it being sniped, did the person who "stole" the mount get banned? No. ( It's in a thread over at the consortium forums )
You buy items at the auction house for well below market price sometimes, are you scamming the person who posted it? Technically yes, anyone who has "morals" would send a message and say, " Hey you posted your stuff too low at the auction house, I'll pay you the real market price " and to be quite frank, I don't think anyone will.
I've even bought patterns worth 3-4,000g for 5g, that right there is a scam. The poster did not know the value of the item otherwise they wouldn't of posted it for so cheap. Did I send a tell to the person who I bought the cheap pattern from? No.
Hell, I've even gone as far as buying stuff from a hacked account. Yes, I've done it, and I'm sure multiple others have as well.
So no, I'm not surprised that Markco posted a lousy gold making strategy, as it happens day in and day out within the game.
Despot said... March 25, 2011 at 3:15 PM
#2 doubles as a gold tip for those who are fine with the morally gray, and a warning to everyone. If you decide to utilise this "sleazy" strategy, that's entirely your choice and depends on where you stand concerning the ethics surrounding the issue.
As Mageshadow mentions, a lot of the things we do to make gold can be viewed as "scams" to some degree because we take advantage of people by buying things for less than they could have sold for, or selling overpriced items. Some people would never buy that whiptail posted at 3g a stack, others would gladly grab a Swift Spectral Tiger at the same price if presented with the opportunity.
It comes down to where you draw the line. For me, if you can't get banned for doing it, then I'm usually fine with it (with certain exceptions when it comes to friends and guildies). I won't force my policy on anyone, and if you do that with yours, commenters, then I'll have to ask you to die in a damn fire.
Archangel said... March 25, 2011 at 5:14 PM
Sorry, Mage. All I read in your posts is "buy Markco's guide". The passion is not there anymore. You know. That thing that is the core engine. The thing that people follow. I look no further then the Maelstrom Crystal post. Again so alarmist, yet not at all insightful. "SELL YOUR STOCK NAOW !!! DUMP THEM ! MARKET IS GONNA CRASH ! AARGHH!" But then again, maybe insightful is not what you want to cultivate here. People don't need to be encouraged to start to think for themselves, they need to be encouraged to buy the guide.
I won't go in further details. Don't get me wrong. JMTC was a great source of many innovative gold making strategies. Was. What it still is, is a great place where the gold making community meet.
I was keeping this to myself, maybe to post it on my own blog (if I'll ever make one) or to post it on someone's else, like I did in the past. But I'll make you a favor just this time. Want to be really helpful and amaze your audience with something interesting ? Everybody is talking about Maelstrom Crystals and how affordable they will be and how they will drop in price, making the enchanting scroll market a blooming one, once again. What about Heavenly Shards ? Almost all top end enchants (now expensive soon to be cheap) use a healthy quantity of it. At least on my server, despite all the dungeon running by people, there were never more then 3 pages of it (~150pcs) mixed with smaller ones. If you check wowecon.com for the last 90 days, you'll see the average volume on all the alliance servers to be around 80 pieces posted at any time.
Keep in mind that, unlike Wrath when you could "produce" the shards via blacksmithing or else, it's not the case anymore in Cata. Isn't it possible that sometime say about 1 month into the next patch, we'll all have our pockets full of Maelstrom Crystals, but we will be scavenging for Heavenly Shards ?
I may end up to be wrong, but I presented you my arguments and I think it will give us something to think about.
Cheers !
Cloud7007 said... March 25, 2011 at 6:03 PM
Anonymous #5- I thought Cloud7007 was a good name, seeing as it's my login name to WoW, but I guess that went over your head.
Either way, the fact of the matter is... Everyone is browsing JMTC to make gold. They're trying to find useful strategies that they can deploy to maximize their profit margin.
When a strategy is put like this: "Watch for prices to drop on pyrite because of epic gems not being released this next patch, gather as much as you can and resell when the gems do drop.", everyone thinks it's solid advice.
But god forbid someone posts something that takes advantage of people who are trying to take advantage of you. I mean, have you really thought about it? You say you wanna buy something you posted for twice as much... Someone else goes "Damn, I can buy this for half the price and totally scam this guy for how much he's paying for it."
But no, they're the victims in this case huh? I seriously don't understand that rationale. And I REALLY don't understand why everyone who has taken all of Markco's tips to heart in the past suddenly turn on him for an "amoral" tip.
I would really like to see you crank out as many tips as he has and have every single one of them be gems in everyone's eyes.
These guys are doing their best and I really appreciate the effort they're putting into this forum. The fact that so many are weakminded enough to desert them after countless great tips is really saddening. But I guess that's reality of the situation.
Archangel said... March 25, 2011 at 6:53 PM
@Cloud700something
Oh spare me the drama. There is someone that provided more gold making ideas than Marcko. It's the community we all dwell in. It's the forum posters. It's the commenters.
And don't start me on the Pyrite ore example of yours. A brilliant thing to do would've been from Mage&Marcko's part, to point out what happened when people stockpiled Titanium ore in the past. Everyone and their mother started to crank epic gems, the moment the ore was prospectable. Without an immediate demand for them, the AH was flooded in no time and smart AH players used this low priced supply to fuel their epic gems stock.
This means to push things a step further. To be smart. Think.
Cloud7007 said... March 25, 2011 at 8:34 PM
@ArchAngel-
That was pretty funny how you left out the last number in my name and replaced it with "something", I see what you did there. Pretty clever.
I guess we can describe a whole community as a person, but I was kind of referring to a single person on this one. You know, like one human being? And I'm saying that people like Mage and Markco are above average when it comes to posting tips. I don't see what the dispute is there.
I especially don't see what the dispute is when it's coming from someone who goes "Maybe one day when I make MY gold guide!" I mean really? You want to be "spared of the drama"? Maybe you should take a look at what you're doing instead.
I mean honestly, why not go on with your great tips and piles of information in a positive way and instead of trying to jump on the bandwagon and going on like "Man that was so bad, you should just throw out your computer and die for that tip"? Seriously? Your ego is ridiculous. You point fingers at everyone else, but you claim to sit on seemingly piles of info and then turn around and go "The community! It's the community!"
So I'm failing to see how you're helping anything by going back and forth between how "the community's the greatest and it's what makes the difference" and then going "Well, I was keeping this to myself..."
Cute name btw. You get that from Mass Effect 2?
Archangel said... March 26, 2011 at 5:29 AM
Actually my real name is Michael, so you see where the Archangel comes from. It's just a nick name like any other.
And you are heavily exaggerating in twisting my remarks. I don't sit on a pile of secret information. That's hilarious. There are just some interesting things I happen to see no blog has covered them. And I didn't say I was thinking to start my own guide. I was talking about a normal blog. Read carefully. Be correct.
What I always did (starting few years back) was to always raise a flag when Marcko did a poor job by being either superficial or not properly documented; You can count my comments here using the fingers from your both hands. That's because I only spoke when there was something to be said.
The thing in your comment that drew my attention was this: "...And I REALLY don't understand why everyone who has taken all of Markco's tips to heart in the past suddenly turn on him for an "amoral" tip...".
No one is turning on Marcko. He's hosting the whole gold making community, don't be silly. Stop being so apocalyptic about it. I think it's a great thing to have people that will poke you when you did something bad, or a poor quality post used as an excuse to advertise ad space, mostly when readers were used to read quality here on JMTC.
Cloud7007 said... March 28, 2011 at 4:11 AM
I clearly don't respond well to the heavy satire of an opinion. In the end, it is just my opinion, and I'd rather someone take a better look at it than starting with "Oh spare me the drama"; it kind of takes my post and diminishes it right out of the gate.
And I can agree that I did go a bit overboard. I tend to run the offensive when I see (in my eyes) someone attacking a good poster.
I guess what really set me off about your post to Mage was "JMTC was a great source of many innovative gold making strategies. Was." It bothered me that someone who really just seems to want to help out with criticism would say something so... depreciative. It's almost like you went "Well, you guys WERE good, but now you kind of suck."
I think these guys are still doing a great job, and I actually do agree with you on the whole "Oh, you can advertise on this site if you want" being a poor gold tip. But I was more in reference to everyone taking the moral high ground and not looking at the other side of things. It's a kind of closemindedness that I think is plaguing a lot of peoples' aspects today.
So yeah, I think that it's cool that you do have your own opinion on it, and I agree with some of it. I just don't think it's ever a great idea to open by going "Dear whoever you are, your opinion is shit" (how I perceived it).
And I guess the way I saw it was when you said "I was keeping this to myself, maybe to post it on my own blog... But I'll make you a favor just this time", was that you more or less went "Here, I came up with this because I'm that good, I'll help you out with your blog because it sucks right now". Maybe you hadn't meant to come off as that extreme, but I perceived it as another asshole who thinks he's better than everyone. I dunno, I can try to be understanding, but that just pissed me off.
Either way, I'd rather reach a respectable ceasefire than an impasse where we simply fling our impressions upon one another.
Btw, Cloud7007 isn't something I just made up on the fly to run anonymous but still look like I'm not. I literally have had this screen name for about 7 or 8 years, be it email, login names, whatever.
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