Frost Lotus Getting So Damn Expensive

Posted by Markco at 8:00 AM

I really wish that blizzard would implement a 'dalaran solution' for Frost Lotus like they did with arctic furs and snowfall inks. Because of the insane prices of frost lotus from all the players saying 'oooh I need this right now I will pay 60 gold for it!' it is a real challenge to make money with flasks like stoneblood. Currently I just sell stonebloods that I get from alchemy procs while learning new flasks, and I never actually produce them myself.

If you're farming or leveling alchemy, try to stay away from frost lotus, it's just not reliable to count on the 15-20% proc from your flask spec to make gold. The best way to make gold with alchemy is to find flasks or potions that make you gold regardless of procs, then those just become icing on the cake.

Should blizzard implement a 'dalaran solution' for Frost Lotus?

23 comments: on "Frost Lotus Getting So Damn Expensive"

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Anonymous said... October 28, 2009 at 8:52 AM

Frost lotus currently run abot 30g each on dunemaul, roughly the price as a flask of endless rage or stoneblood. I remember buying them in bulk of trade chat for 15g each a couple months ago. Good luck now :(
Hellreject said... October 28, 2009 at 8:52 AM

They should either implement a "Dalaran Solution" for Frost Lotuses, or make them drop more frequently. I'd rather see the Dalaran vendor solution though. I feel the vendor solution leaves more wiggle room for gold making instead of increased droprates.
Sajagloll said... October 28, 2009 at 8:55 AM

I believe this problem started when people were posting that blizz lowered the drop rate of frost lotus, which I have to admit it seemed that way for me also as I used to average 5-8 a hour in scholazar but was coming up with just 1-2 if I was lucky.

I believe something has changed mainly because I have been farming herbs for the up coming Faire to make inks and cards, for the last week or so I have been averaging my usual count again currently I have about 8-10 stacks in my guild bank and have sold on average 8 stacks of 5 every night on AH.

I guess in away you could relate this to gas prices let there be a hint there will be a hurricane and gas will jump 20-30 cents over night, same with the frost lotus almost as fast as I read the lines blizz lowered the drop rate of frost lotus in all areas prices jump almost 10 gold each over night, don't get me wrong thats a good thing for myself and all the other farmers out there that do not use frost lotus for anything it basically free gold to us but to alchs because the price of your main matt just went up you either wait out the storm or raise your prices.
Kring said... October 28, 2009 at 9:00 AM

They should remove this lame solution for all the other cases. I hate this soluition because the multiple materials are reduced into one.

Arctic fur are obtained the same way as leather is. AN arctic fur is now the same as if animals would have a small chance to yeald 500 leathers instead of only 2. And leatherworking just uses only borean leather. Arctic furs are just more leather. Just drop the crap fur if you cannot find an equilibrium with normal leather. Or make something that sucks up unused leather. Or bring back the salt shaker. Why doesn't leatherworking have no cooldown although it was the first profession introducing the cooldown system?

Shard shatter. What a crappy bullshit. Why not just remove the mats and make all enchants cost 80 dust and 8 essences? That's so boring. Why do we need 4 materials for enchants? And then be able to "exchange" them. It would be much more interesting if you could exchange the superflous shards for something else. Why not let abyssal shatter produce flasks (alchemists make nice money on jewels, why not let enchanters make money with flasks?)? Or flowers?

Cooldown for transmutation saronite -> titanium removed. Why are there titanium nodes anyway? Just let the receipts use more saronite then. Boring.

Same for the ink. Why are there any kind of other inks than ink of the sea? They only make you convert one into the other. FAIL.

Conversions are ok when they have a cooldown or when they convert something into something which is used and obtained completely different, like prospecting ore into gems.

Arctic furs should be buyable with blue gems (lot of them of course) and therefore opening another path to get them and add a use for the old blue gems. Skinning is already the existing route.

And maybe frost lotus could be bought with borean leather.
Anonymous said... October 28, 2009 at 9:08 AM

Currently Frost Lotus are running from 40-60g on my server. A friend and I used to control the market on them completely and keep them at 50g even.

However, he stopped farming, and when my computer broke I couldn't farm for that two week period, so the market went nuts.

Currently I'm farming for him instead of AH-ing things. 20g a stack for icethorn, lichbloom, and goldclover, and 40g each on frost lotus.

Sadly, in what farming I've done recently, I can't get the damn things to drop.

The Dalaran solution would ruin my main source of income (unless you could trade goldclover stacks for them...I've got tons of that), but it would make life easier on my friend, so I'm torn on the idea.

-TufakofFeathermoon
Anonymous said... October 28, 2009 at 9:41 AM

I really do think something needs to be done regards the current Frost Lotus situation. FL goes for about 45g(ish) on my server, flasks for about 40g each. The main probelm is though demand out strips supply and the prices for both are going up and up over the last week or two.

With the new patch comming (at some point) the situation is only going to get worse as more people will be raiding in my view (LFR interface for example). I remember in BC before around the last patch they upped the drop rate of Fel lotus and this have very little effect on the prices but it meant people could get them to raid with.

Incereasing the drop rate would, again, be my preferred solution. That way Farmers can still farm them and get good money. Raiders can buy them without having to spend more time on gold income. Everyone happy (as if!)
BlueBlackRed said... October 28, 2009 at 9:43 AM

Prior to 3.1 I could buy frost lotuses all day for 8-15g a piece.

Now 50g is the norm on my server, thanks to the "I farm it so it's free" idiocy, there's no point in competing in the flask market.

I switched alchemy specialization to transmutation and haven't turned back.

The solution for the price is greater supply through increased drop rate or an alternate method to getting them.
Increased drop rate is a bit is probably preferable, keeping farmers happy.
The alternate method of "buying" a lotus will have other consequences - like increased lichbloom prices back to pre-3.1 (3-4g each) as farmers have less incentive to farm, which then hits the inscription market, and so on.
Vulpina said... October 28, 2009 at 9:49 AM

The normal price of Frost Lotus on my server is around 40g, but someone unloaded a whole pile of them yesterday for 19g each. Back in the day I wouldn't have touched it for that price, but I bought every darn one of them yesterday.

I would love a solution to the frost lotus problem like they're doing with arctic fur. The drop rate is too too low for it to be a requirement for raid essentials.
Anonymous said... October 28, 2009 at 9:55 AM

I have to admit, I'm honestly amused. I make a KILLING in Alchemy now as an Elixir master with the prices being where they are. Each proc is now worth more but the consumption rate is the same.
Sweetiebird said... October 28, 2009 at 11:58 AM

I'm glad I picked up a boat load when the prices were low. I mean low, at 10g-11g each.

I just regret selling about 500 of them at 30g each :(

The prices are up at about 50g each on my server and I've only got a little over a stack left to sell.
Zeran said... October 28, 2009 at 12:14 PM

Considering that the consensus to my question about flipping my alchemist to elixir spec was "stay xmute" on the forums. I would love either a Dalaran solution or increased drop rate for frost lotus. It would bring flasks back into a profitable place for alchemists on my server (60g frost lotus and 30g flasks). Right now my frost lotus goes to my own raids needs, and I make money on gem xmutes. I'm looking forward to the titanium change as it will make titansteel easier (no one uses 300g/stack ore to make titanium bars)

-Zeran
Breevok said... October 28, 2009 at 3:26 PM

Sorry to go against the flow - but why does everything need to be so readily available? Why do we need a 'dalaran' solution? Its not as thought golds in short fall in the game. If flasks cost 30g a pop to cover the price of frost lotus being 45g a pop then so be it. The procs still make us gold. You give a dalaran solution and the price of lotus falls. The the price of flasks also falls. No doubt the profit will be around the same - or minimally increased at best.

When you ask your question, what you are really asking is 'hands up if you want to make flasks cheaper for the masses' - well not I. Cheaper flasks is of no benefit to the goblin - it just benefits the consumer. How very social of you!
Bob said... October 28, 2009 at 3:58 PM

Ah, but breevok, you're forgetting. If you market to the masses you may be getting the same profit from each sale, but your are making many many many more sales, and much faster. It's the Walmart strategy: sell cheap to EVERYONE.
Revanché said... October 28, 2009 at 4:04 PM

I feel your pain to, since i entered the alchemy market the price on Lotus's has risen from 20g up to its current 55-70g.

This has caused a distinct separation in the market, those that farm for themselves and craft flasks/pots/elixirs, and those like myself who buy from the AH and then craft.

Fortunately the former are few and far between and I've taken steps to hamper my competition in the former.
Breevok said... October 28, 2009 at 4:32 PM

Bob - we'll agree to differ. Flasks are flasks. For the vast majority they arent negotiable. Not having a flask is like not having a food buff. People buy flasks.

Personally I am a little sick of Blizzard dumbing down WoW. All aspects of the game are being changed to ensure 'everyone has a fair go'. From giving everyone Emblems of Conquest (soon to be Triumph) for skipping through Nexus, allowing those people who havent bothered to put in the grind to level their fishing the ability to fish in Northrend, and soon arctic fur to be purchaseable with Heavy Borean Leather.

I have a skinner friend that isnt a goblin - he is a good player who does his dailies and gets enough gold to gem his gear, buy his enchants and cover his flasks and repair costs. Whenever he gets an arctic fur its a special moment for him - it means something. All these nerfs just pander to the masses and take the joy out of the game for those who are putting in the effort.

You nerf the access of frost lotus you just punish the herbalists who get their money by farming - frost lotuses are those ;woot' moments for them - dont steal it from them.
Anonymous said... October 28, 2009 at 4:52 PM

I'm with Breevok on this one. I actually enjoyed profitting from my gathering skills. With the "Dalaran Solutions" coming into play, I suddenly can't get rid of my arctic furs, I don't even try to sell my extra infinite dust or essences (frankly, I can make more gold from selling enchants using them now).

Mind you, I think a crafter should be able to turn a profit from a group of single raw materials by turning them into a finished product... but I think we've all seen how rare this is for EVERY profession.

So. Not much of a fan of the Dalaran Solution, from a player point of view. May be a GREAT solution for a heavy-sales-person... but I'm fairly casual and enjoy the aspects of the game that make PLAYING it (not just the AH) enjoyable and in many cases profitable to the casual player.
Anonymous said... October 28, 2009 at 4:57 PM

I'm on a server where mats almost invariably sell more than finished product (inks and glyphs don't sell, but herbs do; bars don't sell, but ore does, etc.). Frost Lotus is one of the few things I can be absolutely sure will sell reliably. Anything that makes it easier for non-herbalists to get will mess me up good.
Anonymous said... October 28, 2009 at 8:10 PM

Hey markco, I have a question. Your website has really inspired me to start using auctioneer to make gold because of the little time taken and the gold made. When i finish my scans it says lots of items have low ( or blue ) "PCT". i look it up in the auction house but all the other items are priced for around the same. My auctioneer says my database is 65 days old and that it is disabled even though i've scanned the AH. What am i doing wrong? Please answer.
Unknown said... October 28, 2009 at 9:05 PM

To the last anonymous...
I suggest you take a look at the forums here, esp in the add on section. Also, the auctioneer addon suite has a great website and forum community as well. They (auctioneer/norganna's group) have a support forum and a discussion forum/ I'm sure between these two great communities you can find the answer to your problem, along with many helpful hints.
Anonymous said... October 28, 2009 at 9:16 PM

what was the 'dalaran solution' for snowfall inks?
chaoskas said... October 29, 2009 at 4:54 AM

10 Ink of the Sea = 1 Snowfall Ink

I think a dalaraan solution should be avoided but it should be possible to farm theese things better. Last week I bought 30 Stacks of Adders tongue and got 6(!) Snowfall Ink. This week I got 17 out of 20 Stacks...

A few feeks ago I famed arctic fur. 1 hour and uncounted rhinos later I had _none_ but 3 Stacks of Rhinomeat and more leather than I could carry. It was a great moment when I entered Trial of the crusader because I was the only skinner and Icehowler and Anub yield one fur each. It is easier to farm 100g than one fur. Just ridicoulus.
RyanC said... October 29, 2009 at 10:44 AM

WTF???

Anyone who thinks the "Frost Lotus Problem" is a real problem, likely isn't on the profit side of the equation.

Step 1: Be like Dell

Dell has a Just In Time Inventory solution, where they keep all the parts they need for computers, but don't actually make the computers until they get an order.

This prevents them from holding onto obsolete or undesirable inventory.

As such, you need to have Lichbloom, Icethorn, Goldclover, Eternal Life & empty flasks on hand...you should NEVER have any inventory above 2-3 flasks of each type.

You go to the AH, figure out which is the most profitable of the flasks to make, and make them. At any one time on our server, one of the big 4 flasks are completely sold out and one is usually very expensive...typically Stoneblood & Frost Wyrm. So I make about 8 of each, and post them.

BALLPARK MATH* (*So eff-the-eff off if you can't adjust the numbers on your own server)
Each Mute = 2.5 flasks. That means we need 6.4 Lotus, but let's just say 7 Xmutes will yield 17.5 flasks. @ 40-45g per, that's 280-315g in mats. 40 Lichbloom/Icethrorn = 40-60g. Plus some Goldclover/Lifes = 40g.

At the high end of material cost, that's 415 g for 17.5 flasks, which will sell for 40g meaning 700g. That's a 69% return on investment.

ROI: Gain - Cost/Cost

2. You cannot count on the proc rate, but it IS there and it DOES happen. Your assertion that you can't rely on the proc is like saying I can't rely on the heads/tails ratio being 50% because when I make the guess I'm wrong half the time.

If I flip the coin 1000 times, and guess 500 heads and 500 tails my accuracy rate rises to 99%.

You price the proc into the making of the flasks and just make them and let the KNOWN PROC RATE take care of itself. Right now it is known each Frost Lotus makes 2.5 flasks (25% proc rate)

So if each flask sells for 40, then each Potion Transmute = 100g. If you can assemble the mats for each transmute for less than 100g, you profit. For more than 100g, loss. For 100g, breakeven.

Anyone complaining that "the price is going to go through the roof" is an idiot, because that's an opportunity.

Hint: GO BUY SOME IF YOU THINK THE PRICE IS GOING TO GO THROUGH THE ROOF! 3.3 IS INTRODUCING NO NEW FLASKS, AND PEOPLE WILL STOP GOING TO ULDUAR (FREYA!) AND THOSE FLASKS AND HERBS WILL ALSO MAKE THE LOTUS MORE SCARCE.

It's pretty funny coming to a money making blog, and see a bunch of people wondering about what to do, and not profiting from the situation or begging Blizz for a "Dalaran Solution".
Anonymous said... October 30, 2009 at 11:50 AM

^^^ he speaks the truth. I'm not sure if many of you realize how much profit you can actually make off flask making. I buy lotuses at 35g, lichbloom and icethorn at 20g and goldclover at 10g. Of course, this is minimal profit, but if you make numerous amounts of flasks, you WILL proc extras which is pure profit of whatever the flask sells for. The proc isn't really reliable, but when you get lucky, it really pays off. I've found certain days/times flasks will very fast if you have the cheapest. Find out how much the mats cost and how much 2 flasks will sell for, and if you can make even marginal profit, buy a shitload of lotuses and undercut by a little bit if you got few procs and undercut by more if you proc a lot. There is a constant need for flasks, and not that many people making them. Use this to your advantage.

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