Let's get it started in here! (FYI: referral links included in post)
Wow Confidential came out with a new gold making forum with a twist, it's paid members only.
Many people in this community have emailed me asking that I take a look at this new forum and write a review of the benefits of paying to access a wow gold forum. As many of you know I run my own forum aimed at making gold in world of warcraft so I have a pretty good idea of what to look for in deciding if this forum is worth visiting. Wow Confidential's site owner, Kraklin, gave me access to his forum upon request and this helped me do a review of how it's going so far.
Wow Confidential Paid Forum
-No spam.
-No trolling.
-Questions given special attention by admins and answered promptly, it's almost like a tutoring service for wow gold help.
-Ideas are kept secret to this close knit community, which means you could figure out the next big money making strategy before anyone else catches on for some time.
-Several major wow gold makers are on the forums as admins and are quite knowledgeable.
How is the forum doing so far after only being around for a week? Not too shabby actually with over a hundred members, a few millionaires, good discussions and interactions between the admins and members... all nice things so far. There's tons of room for more content, but the foundation for something special is definitely in place. I really like the concept of keeping some things secret and having a paid only access system meaning only those willing to spend the money will know the tips. As cataclysm hits and everyone is searching for gold knowledge, wouldn't it be valuable to have a place where no one else knows your secrets? For this reason alone I feel that this forum is really going to shine in cataclysm when people want to know information which no one else knows. FYI: I will continue to offer my forums for free, relying on ads, donations, and perks to cover hosting costs.
What the wow confidential forum really needs now is you. The intelligent, thinking auctioneers who want to keep some secrets private, but don't worry, I'll give you a run for your money providing the community here everything I can for free. Personally I really like wow confidential's blog site as it has always provided good information in an easy to digest manner and I wish him the best of luck with his new forum. It needs members though and much more content so if you want to get on board this promising forum before it really goes crazy with cataclysm information I suggest doing so right now because Wow Confidential has stated that the price of the forum will rise for those that wait until cataclysm to become a part of it.. Be a part of something new and fun that is only going to get better.
What do you think? Could a paid forum be worth it if information appeared on there before anywhere else? Do you prefer the open and free information found within my own gold making forums instead? Will the Wow Confidential forum flop or prosper come cataclysm?
31 comments: on "Paid Wow Gold Forum"
jimmyolsenblues said... August 4, 2010 at 8:14 AM
Please don't go to a pay site!
I think when you are struggling to make gold you get desperate and would be willing to learn so called "secrets".
My biggest secrets:
1) Get a second account to move goods cross faction. Be aware of your cross faction price differences for trade goods, gems, glyphs..etc.
2) Google Markco's 22 steps to auctioneer
3) Google Markco's steps to Quick Auction 3
4) You simply need more characters, I have every profession maxed out except engineering and skinning, because I don't like engineering and I dropped my skinner for a 2nd JC, just for the daily quest.
Thanks Markco , I learned that stuff on your free site. Didn't cost me 1c.
Shadowstep said... August 4, 2010 at 8:30 AM
You should probably go with full disclosure, those are referral links to their forum. I don't care if you do, but don't hide that they are referral links. Its bad taste
Markco said... August 4, 2010 at 9:32 AM
I apologize for not including them. I am hoping to promote Wow Confidential's forum because I know with the right minds involved it will become a close knit and powerful think tank for making gold.
Keep the comments coming though, I'd like to see more viewpoints regarding whether it's worth it to pay for this kind of content or if my system of 99.99% free content works better for all involved.
JayTekStorm said... August 4, 2010 at 10:11 AM
I don't see it working. What other tips or secrets are going to be out there that won't be discussed on this blog or forum? or any other gold blog for that matter. The community has gotten quite large now and secrets are hard to keep.
Even there is secrets that can be kept they are usually farming related and blizzard catches on quick to drop rates being to high. Markco knows this from farming videos he has posted in the past where blizz soon after nerfed the drop rates of cloth and other items.
Goodluck to his paid forum, I hope it works but in the end I don't see it becoming a large community.
Mageshadow said... August 4, 2010 at 10:21 AM
I don't agree with having paid forums.... honestly what godly and secret information is there that people don't already know about?
Markco said... August 4, 2010 at 10:26 AM
Great points, what about the idea of having "tutors" so to speak to help you play? Isn't that what these kind of forums really are for newer players?
wayne said... August 4, 2010 at 10:29 AM
I thik it's bad form promoting a paid for forum.
Paid for forums are like paid for guide (sorry markco, not a personal dig) You can find it for free with a little bit of research...there are no secrets. I read multiple forums and they all basically say the same thing.
If someone figures something out it's highly likely that others will as well and at best you may be able to keep it a 'secret' for a week or so.
If it's that big a deal and you want to exploit it you don't broadcast it [anywhere] until you've milked it yourself first.
Charging for a gold guide or charging for a gold making website is just the same as selling on the AH...It's praying on suckers who don't know any better. So i find it quite ironic that wow bussiness-people would pay to use a site like that.
iceveiled said... August 4, 2010 at 10:42 AM
I'll stick with the free JMTC. Seems absurd to charge for a site about how to make FAKE money in a game.
Izzie said... August 4, 2010 at 10:42 AM
(I apologize if this is a double post, the first time it ate my comment o_O)
I think it defeats the purpose.
For myself and a lot of players, we go to gold-making blogs to learn how to make gold instead of having to resort to buying it from china-farmers.
What's the point, then, of paying for knowledge?
I already paid and continue to pay for this game. It's not worth it to pay for extra content.
The instance where I see this being worth the investment is for legit farmers who actually sell gold. There are a lot of players who do (without hacking or stealing accounts, so I'm ok with that)like college kids trying to make extra bucks, and for them to be ahead of the game would be worth the minimal investment on the forums.
Otherwise, meh. I agree with Jay, we may not be first to know the ins and outs but it doesn't matter.
Anonymous said... August 4, 2010 at 10:54 AM
"Isn't that what these kind of forums really are for newer players?"
So essentially what you are trying to say is that the paid forum is geared towards new players that don't know anything about the game?And since they don't know better, they will be more than willing to whip out that CC and get connnected. To me that almost reads as, hey come to this site and pay 10bucks and we will give you 1000 gold.
Isn't that the same thing?
Are these new players really the ones goblins are worried about? Doubtful...more than likely it is just watching out for some other goblin who wants to cash in quick.
I do wish him luck with them as it is a very smart business decision. He can now profit from his own experience, but isn't that what a true goblin desires anyway?
Anonymous said... August 4, 2010 at 10:57 AM
My interest in going to a paid WoW sight = 0.00%
I see nothing to be gained that I can't read from others or I can't figure out on my own.
Markco said... August 4, 2010 at 11:10 AM
When I spoke to Kraklin, he informed me that the #1 reason to become a forum member on his site would be for the one on one tutoring. I'm curious, would you pay $6.99 or whatever it costs for a month of tutoring? I can see the reasons for a yes or a no, but what do you think? Is the short cut worth it? How long have you been playing if you answer yes or no?
Mageshadow said... August 4, 2010 at 11:36 AM
Like I said unless there are some super secret tips that I haven't heard of until now that are being kept away from the rest of the public... I see no reason to "pay for knowledge"
Shadowstep said... August 4, 2010 at 12:46 PM
What i see happening with this is that any truly good ideas will very quickly get leaked to the community anyway since there is no way to stop people from paying to be there and sharing the information with the world out of spite for wow confidential methods.
Markco said... August 4, 2010 at 1:01 PM
Shadowstep, I almost deleted the comment because it's a little extreme.
Your point would be totally valid IF Kraklin's forums were solely about keeping "secrets." What about the one on one tutoring? I don't see how you could "leak" that. Maybe it would be valuable information to some but everyone's situation is so unique!
Really enjoying the discussion on this topic, it seems the majority of my audience (at least the vocal part) believe that Kraklin's forum will not be worth the price.
Jebby Boy said... August 4, 2010 at 1:02 PM
I don't like the idea of paying for access to a forum...buuuutttt I would do it if necessary.
I feel that having free gold sites like this are awesome, but they end up becoming so widely known that EVERYONE learns about them and then EVERYONE is implying the same gold making techniques on a realm.
Eventually you're back to farming and questing to make gold because everyone is doing the same thing you are, and there's no chance of making a good income.
If you were to even charge just $2.50 for you're site/forums ($2.50 per month to get access to your site AND the forum together) then it'd help keep most techniques confidential, AND it'd eliminate some of the less dedicated people. I'd pay $2.50 in a heartbeat for access to the site, even a bit more. It's not much money, and it would just act as a sort of filter to keep the hard workers on top, and the mass under-cutters below us.
Gnolie said... August 4, 2010 at 1:03 PM
I pay $10 a year for EJBB I'm definitely not going to pay $6.95 a month for a forum, that is insane. Whoever thought of this is huffing a significant amount of glue.
$10 a year is about all I'm willing to pay for forum access, and it has to be a forum with known benefits I'm not just tossing $7 sight unseen.
Fallstaff said... August 4, 2010 at 1:06 PM
IDK. if i were a betting man, my money would be on your 20k lvling and your blog over some paid blog. heres why.
A. you dont have to buy the book to use your blog cause its Free. and sometimes that works with some people due to age
B. if you like jmtc blog then your going to love the book because of the on hand info and the updates. no more wasting time combing for info.
c. the on hand community that has formed around this great blog.
d.call to auction and castaclysm pod casts. now Markco may be in more but these are the 2 i listen to. besides, Markco makes your lives less boring.
e. frankly if you've gotten this far then whats $6.95 going to do for you that you havent already done for yourself by now?
p.s. did you know Markco was a gladiator?
Jebby Boy said... August 4, 2010 at 1:11 PM
Also the one-on-one tutoring would be worth its weight in gold. Having someone to walk you thru things step by step would be a wonderful thing to have.
Markco, you do a great job with all the information you provide on your site and forums, but I would love to have you as a personal advisor in all my money making endeavors whenever I needed you. I'd definitely pay a couple of bucks for that.
Cold said... August 4, 2010 at 1:19 PM
As a business model it is no worse of an idea than selling gold blogs. More power to him to get as many subscribers as he can. I won't be paying, but then again, I run a gold blog.
I predict people will pay for 1 to 2 months of membership before realizing how much of the info is free elsewhere before they start to drop their subscriptions. IMHO the money would be better spent paying for the remote auction house once a grasp of the gold making process is more understood.
As far as "Top-Secret Info"...yeah right. In this day and age there is no such thing online. Anyone with half a brain who develops a super secret method to make gold is going to abuse the hell out of it long before they post it anywhere online for the masses to copycat.
PS: The comment I left on the original post about whether fellow gold bloggers would get free access to help out never made it through the site comment moderation. So go figure.
Cold said... August 4, 2010 at 1:26 PM
As far as one-on-one tutoring....
Who needs that? Between JMTC and the blogs in Markco's blogroll alone there are answers to just about anything you can ask.
One on One, as in I tell you what to do, and you as the lemming follow my advice to the tee, regardless of all the variables that need to be figured into the AH environment, which the lil lemmings have no idea about. So in turn, even with one on one tutoring, what real good can it do?
The lemmings post their professions and ask for help, the "tutoring" happens, then the lemmings try it out. Lo and behold, it just doesn't work on their server because so so so much more goes into running a successful AH business than just make this and flip that. Soon they become disenheartened and cancel their subscription and flame the "fail" tutoring they payed for.
Just my opinions and predictions.
Liam said... August 4, 2010 at 2:10 PM
Im there since it started and I can tell you now, that unlike free forums there are no spam, no adverts and direct contact with people who are willing to actually help.
No one is going to reply "GO JC LOL, GEMS ARE COOL BRAH". On the other gold forums I notice a lot of people dont contribute either.
You will get decent answers with well informed reasoning behind it.
xoxo anaalius
wayne said... August 4, 2010 at 3:28 PM
Markco said...
When I spoke to Kraklin, he informed me that the #1 reason to become a forum member on his site would be for the one on one tutoring. I'm curious, would you pay $6.99 or whatever it costs for a month of tutoring? I can see the reasons for a yes or a no, but what do you think? Is the short cut worth it? How long have you been playing if you answer yes or no?
For a start i said no in my earlier post, and i have been playing the game since the first year it was out and playing the AH for around 2-3 years now.
Is the shortcut worth it? Even with personal tutoring?
No. is the plain answer.
Why?
Well for the simple reason you can get free tutoring by simply asking questions on one of the many free forums already out there and not only will you get 1 answer from a 'specialist' you tend to get multiple answers with a much broader spectrum and a much broader idea of the concept, so in a way your actually restricting your resources by relying on 1 single source.
And if you do spread your resources around.i.e. use other sites and ask questions there, then what is the point in paying for the one you are?
For someone who has no clue and is daunted by the task ahead i can see why it would be an attractive idea, as are gold making guides, but even when i started out i wouldn't have paid for anything and i would always recommend people who are starting out to simply do a little research themselves rather than pay for any advice.
If you learn to research yourself and adapt what you learn to your personal situation you will be a lot more sucessful than simply following some guide or what one person says.
Anonymous said... August 4, 2010 at 4:25 PM
I mentioned before that I thought as business model it is a smart plan for him.
@Markco- you keep bringing up that the major idea there is that you will have tutoring. I think last time you mentioned he already had 100 people who signed on to the forums. Assuming that his tutoring is there, that gives each person roughly an hour of one on one attention per week as of right now. What happens when that number shoots up to 500 people. 168 hours in a full week give each person 30 minutes or so of personalized time. Now I am not saying that it couldn't happen, but honestly, what is being offered is a service for the knowledge that has been gained over time. Why though when there is free information out there would people pay for it.
It seems very much like insider trading, but there is really only one person making out with the cash here.
Like I said I think the business model is a service that people could use, but in the end what are they really going to get? Tutoring will most likely be impossible, and will be nothing more than sharing ideas of what works for this person, and what works for that person on each server. Much like what already goes on at several blogs.
I love the idea of the forum, but perhaps a pledge of money to keep the site going, thus easing the cost to him, would be better served. Donate X amount you gain access to the members area.
Mysticzin said... August 4, 2010 at 5:26 PM
I love learning, and this blog was the first that I have settled into reading daily. The Blogging Carnival has opened my eyes to others- some I like and some ... not so much. I use a fabulous leveling guide, and don't mind paying to play the game because there is so much to it. Having said that, would I pay to learn? Maybe. I have been playing for about 2 years, am a working adult, not at all stupid... and still cannot seem to make anything near the gold I will need in Cata. Would they help me more than Marcko? The podcasts Marcko does help me the most BY FAR. However, for a "noob" to the gold making world, it would be nice to have someone help me personally. After all, I can read every blog every day at the office (shhh!) but if I can't make it work in-game, shouldn't I get a chance to learn a different way? Don't smoke, and I don't go out much anymore, this is my play money! So I spend it however I want :-) Teach me!
Tarel said... August 4, 2010 at 6:03 PM
This is something I would never pay for but that is just me. I have yet to see a game that I cant make more gold than I ever need.
The basics of goldmaking isnt the lets go get x and turn them into y and sell or any other variation. It is understanding how to obtain goods ie farming/buying/trading and how and when to sell them and in what format to sell them ie as is, different number or converted into another product. For all of your excellent advice Markco, many of your tips just never materialized on my server. It doesnt mean that you are wrong on what your tips are but that you have to learn to adjust for the market that you are in. The tips may apply to a number of servers but there are just too many for anyone to ever assume a tip will mean the same thing will work on their server.
In my view there is way more value in understanding the various addons and how to use them. The one item that I have learned about on this site that just saves me so much time is the use of quick auctions. If other items arise or can be made that assist in goldmaking, then that would be of more value than advice on what to farm/sell. I can determine for myself quite easily what to sell and how to get it.
Joeyjoejoe said... August 4, 2010 at 6:06 PM
There are no secrets to making gold, anyone who does a little bit of research can know all the best ways to make gold at this point in the expansion.
I personally wouldn't pay money for something i can receive for free (unless I wanted to support the creator), and I'm not sure that there's anything that admins can "tutor" people about these days that isn't already on a free forum somewhere.
I guess we will know whether their paid forums was a good idea by seeing the results after it's been out for a while.
HappyGlypher said... August 4, 2010 at 7:43 PM
I guess you have to look at the demographic the forums are aimed at. Sure, the information is out there, with a little bit of effort you can find many methods to making gold in WoW. However, just like anything in life, people will pay for the convenience of not having to put the effort in to search for the information, and to have someone spoonfeed them. They also pay for the confidence that someone will respond to them on the forums.
I see it all the time on the JMTC forums, people always ask the same basic questions because they're too lazy/incompetent/whatever else reason too search for the answer themselves.
What the paid customers are paying for isn't necessarily the information, it's the ease of access.
Anonymous said... August 6, 2010 at 4:47 AM
Well, most valid points have already been pointed out. What this reminds of after all is the mentality people still have, that everything on the Internet is supposed to be...
"why pay if its free somewhere else lol" hmmm, don't know. I would recommend that all the guys that really invest their time and effort into developing strategies, etc get paid for their effort.
I would suggest that jmtc forums change as well to a paid content board where you can only see the insider info if you donated.
It's right, there is no magic "I win" button for the AH Game, and there are no real secrets. With this knowledge why do people constantly check out gold blogs and forums? Because they didn't think of a certain method or just to see how other folks do it. Or because they are lazy and wan to be mouth-fed with strategies on making gold.
The thing that bugs me the most about paid content is the insecurity of the payment methods, at least it was that way 2 years ago when I last checked.
I would say, pay people for their work, that is just fair.
regards,
Jinx
Anonymous said... August 9, 2010 at 12:18 PM
Some interesting comments here and just realized something after reading about the theory the demographic the paid forum may be for.
Everyone here is working a market and the goal is to be most efficient in that market thus making the greatest profit in the shortest time. Is this not exactly who this paid forum is for? Sure, I can go search and re-search... re-search again, but it would be most efficient if I can just go to one place to ask the question I have. If it takes me five times as long to do my own research, I would save myself four times the gold by going to this one, efficient resource. The same holds true in-game, sure I can go farm (i.e. research) mats to sell/craft, but it is generally far more efficient to buy from the AH (pay for a service, i.e. farming).
Also, what may be even more relevant, is this not exactly what a business is? You learn the tricks and knowledge of the trade/market and offer your services for a cost (and generally mark up that cost as much as you can). Think of a locksmith. Yes, the locksmith only took 2 minutes to unlock your door and charged $100. Why so much? Because of the knowledge to get the door open. Also, why go to the doctor? I could research my symptoms, but who has that much time to devote to gaining the knowledge? All of this information can be found free in your public library (or Internet).
I find it ironic that so many commenter's say to go find the info in all the free resources, but this is the opposite philosophy that is used in-game for gold making. I thought people were applying real life techniques to the virtual world, but don't agree to apply "virtual techniques" in real life.
I originally started into making gold maybe one month ago with my main goal to hit the gold cap before Cataclysm. My other secondary goal is to learn about business, markets, and economy since in college I hated economics and am very ignorant in the matter. What do you think, am I learning anything here? I'm starting to love capitalism in its finest: yesterday, I bought-out a market at 80% and immediately flipped for 200% which began selling in 10 minutes.
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